w34z3l

w34z3l:

@colly191091

RFI probably needs a little tweaking. UTG and MP are a little tight and should be around 13% and 18% respectively. CO is a little too aggressive and should usually be toned down to 28% or so. The numbers are roughly in the right ballpark though.

Raise flop cbet is low. It's around 8% and should be more like 15%. Just means we are not bluff-raising flops as much as we should. Not a big deal at this stage, perhaps something to think about for the future.

No big problems with fold to flop and turn cbet stats. They are both a little bit too high making it profitable for our opponents to cbet very aggressively. But this is not a huge deal at the lower limit games.

Thanks man! I shall get working on the things you noted!

w34z3l: @Pokerruudje,

Ok, overall graph and winrate look great, so something is going right over this sample.

While you state that your red-line is climbing because of your BTN steals, I would say this absolutely not the case. You are actually extremely passive on the BTN, opening just 36% of hands when we could be opening 48% or more. The red line must be the way it is for another reason. Basically there is room to steal a lot more aggressively on boththe BTN and the SB. SB rfi is around 26.3 and should be at least 36%. Open raises from other positions look fine apart from EP where we should be openining significantly tighter. 14% instead of 18%.

3bet game actually looks very good for these limits. There is room to expand your aggression, from the SB for example, but the general idea is that you are positionally aware and this will be one of the contributing factors to your red-line.

Vs 3bet fold is reasonable. Normally I would say it is on the low side, but given you are opening such a tight range in the first place, it is to be expected.

Cold-call numbers look a little strange. Notice how your CC% is basically the same from MP/CO/BTN/SB. It shouldn't be like this. CC should be around 6. So should MP. Maybe CO around 8-9. Btn should be just over 10. Maybe 12. BB cold-call of 17% indicates big blind is not defended enough since the cold-calling frequency should be over 20%.

Cbet stats look ok. Turn and river barrels are actually very high. This will be another contributing factor to your red-line. It probably doesn't need too much adjusting but I wouldn't be surprised to find one or two spots in your DB where you have barreled the turn too aggressively without equity. I could be wrong though, it might just be a function of the tight open-raising range. Naturally if we open wider, our cbetting stats usually get a little lower.

Fold vs cbet stats are ok, apart from fold-to-river cbet which is around 45.9%. This is too low. Should be more like 60%. This is mirrored in your river call efficiency which is an extremely low 1.01. Basically, you are probably making some bad river calls. This will cause your red line to be arbitrarily high for the wrong reasons. In other words, some of the correct adjustments for you right now will likely make your red-line a little lower. W$SD being a shade below 50% also suggests one or too light river calls.

Flop raise cbet is around 10% and could be around 15%. This is another area to focus on maybe a bit later. Bluff-raising flops more aggressively.

Something doesn't feel 100% ok with 3bet pot numbers. Cbetting way too much in theory. Also looks like we are potentially calling down too much vs cbets. I get the general feeling that we are not folding enough in 3bet pots. Certainly makes us tougher to play against, but can be problematic at lower limits since our opponents often enter into 3bet pots with a much stronger range than they should.

Delayed cbet is a relatively neutral 57%, and should be through the roof at these limits. Maybe even above 80%.

Bet vs skipped cbet stats look good, but should be noticeably higher on flop and turn. Grats on getting your river bet vs skipped cbet so high, I'm really wondering if there are some bad plays there with such a high frequency.

Bet turn OOP vs skip is 45.9% and significantly too low. Bet river OOP vs skip is 77.2% and very good.

Ok, great results overall, but a number of issues with the stats.

Thanks W34z3l for you’re comments.

RFI from EP -> some hands i’ve quit from my range -> A2s t/m A9s, K9s, Q9s, KJo, QJo
Some new hands in my range:
BTN: K2s t/m K8s, Q2s t/m Q7s, J4s t/m J7s, T6s, 96s, 85s, 74s, 64s, A2o t/m A5o, K7o, K8o, Q8o,Q9o,J9o
SB: K2 t/m K5s, Q4s t/m Q7s, 64s, 54s, A7o, A8o, K9o, Q9o, J9o, T9o
At this moment (the last two months)
UO PFR% -> SB goes from 26,3 to 29,8, CO 26,4 to 28,1, BTN 36,0 to 39,2 -> it could better
Flop Raise -> from 9,96 to 13,5

So a lot to do!

Cheers Weasel, that's given me some good areas to work on. Infact I've already I've already noticed a difference in my ref-line albeit a small sample.

Here's my fold to 3bet are I 2bet. Attached Image

@Archinator

If those are your fold to 3bet stats, then you are clearly not folding too much. Calling too much if anything. I would expect to see around 60% fold to 3bet overall at your limits. Maybe even slightly higher for exploitative reasons.

Hi w34z3l! I lost all my database due to new computer but here is some previous data I had! It doesn't have everything you asked but if you can do anything with t that would be great

Hi Weazel,

thanks in advance for your time on this!

here with relevant stats although i couldn't find the delayed bet stats on my Pokertracker 4

best

John

Attached Image

just reloaded those images to show totals (missing on my first upload)!

Also this is all at 25nl and 50nl Pokerstars regular tables

hey W34z3l good to see you over at VIP too! new years target to break into 50nl this year, seem to be crushing 10nl and slight looser at 25nl (-2bb) after my first two shots over 50k hands but I feel like should be winning and perhaps some bad spots or varience as i'm beating 10nl very comfortabley on stars, stan james & party.

anyways, here is my last 50k hands on party, not sure how I can merge with my stars history but should be good enough to start here; thanks man!

Notes
You will notice cbet probably on the lower size, this is really distorted by the OOP figure being very low opting for check call or check raise alot but perhaps this is a leak at 10/25nl and I can get more EV by betting myself vs most passive opponants.

Running real bad first 30k, had alot of coolers all in preflop spots, was actually loosing hard with AA,KK & QQ and especially destroyed in some bad spots in the BB but then crushing for the second 25k

@Jef147

Ok, so we are missing a few things as mentioned, but let's see what we can do with the current info.

First thing is VPIP/PFR is 17/14. This is pretty tight. It's probably possible to win at low limit games with this style, but it seems as if we are missing out on some easy preflop money. The next place I would check if we had the stat is our RFI stats from key steal positions, i.e BTN,CO,SB. Presumably these values might be low and we are missing a bunch of steal attempts.

If we check out the 3bet numbers, we can see that while we are reasonably aggressive from the blinds (which is probably good), our 3bets in position look a little bit lacking. Notice how there is hardly any difference between our MP 3betting frequency and our BTN 3betting frequency. We should likely focus a lot more of our energy on 3betting IP, especially from BTN.

Generally speaking we are actually 3betting someone aggressively we an overall frequency of 7.76. So it must be the raise-first-ins and the cold-calls which are letting us down. Unfortunately we can't know our cold-call from this sample (We need "call PF 2bet" in PT4 for this), but we can see specifically cold-calls for BTN,CO,MP. These values look surprisingly low. We'd expect to see BTN cold-call around 12%. So basically it seems as if we are simply not cold-calling enough generally. It's probably important to establish what our cold-call is in the big-blind also, since this is where we do most of our cold-calling, but not available on this sample unfortunately.

Actually, what we do have is the BB fold-to-steal, and it probably should not be as high as 73%, so it's probably safe to say that we are not defending our BB enough.

WWSF is low, and this is especially surprising given that we are playing such a tight range of hands preflop. We are probably missing some bluffing opportunities postflop. This is something to worry about a bit later once preflop strategy has been fixed.

Cbet F and Cbet T, look overly passive. Flop is 57%, turn is 38.5%. Actually 57% is not super unreasonable, but if we are opening a range that is way too tight (as we suspect), then there is a good chance it should be higher. At these limits we are typically aiming for around 65% flop cbet, with a turn cbet of around 52%. We can see that turn cbet is significantly lower than this, so we must be missing some great opportunities to double-barrel semi-bluff. (Or at least, this is the most likely thing. Sometimes there can be other causes, such as slowplaying value-hands too much etc).

Anyway, based on this review start by doing the following -

- Ascertain exactly which range of hands you are using for RFI, cold-calling and 3betting.

@karmakaze

Yeah, you won't find delayed bet stats in PT4. Maybe it's available as a custom stat somewhere though.

VPIP/PFR look fine.

RFI numbers look pretty decent, but we must be missing some steal attempts from the BTN and SB. Best solution is to make sure we have both the FTS and the Vs-SB-Open-BB-fold stats on our HUD. If both blinds have a overall FTS around 80% or above, we should open any 2 on the BTN. If the BB has a fold-to-SB-steal of 60% or higher, we should open any 2 cards in the SB.

3bet numbers look fine. We can probably push it a bit further in MP/CO/BTN. In other words, a little more room to increase 3bet aggression IP here. BB seems slightly low. I would be tempted to filter for BB vs SB open situation and just double check that BB 3bet is at least 15% in this spot.

Fold to 3bet (after 2bet) is fine. Keep in mind that there shouldn't necessarily be a big difference in this number based on position. We want to be careful of calling too many hands against a 3bet in UTG or MP just because our opening range is stronger.

Fold to cbet stats.....Flop and Turn look ok.....River really doesn't look right at 29.91%. I find it really hard to imagine you not having some noticeable river calling errors with this stat. Send me a PM and I will give you a link to some forum threads you should check out. Same thing in 3bet pots by the looks of it. Seems as if we are calling down way too much vs 3barrels.

Cbet stats are ok, just a little passive. You have 59/47/47, and I would typically recommend 65/52/44 for these games. Probably missing some flop cbets and some turn barrels. We can't say exactly where from the frequencies but it's something that will need to be looked into.

3bet cbet stats look reasonable, probably overly aggressive if anything, so going slightly the other way from single-raised-pots.

Raise-flop-cbet is 12.48%, which is a decent value. Could be a shade higher.

Generally speaking WTSD/WWSF/WSD look great. WTSD feels a shade high, probably means we could more aggressive in certan spots, but it's also partly a style thing. 25% is considered correct in theory, but if we are taking an aggressive game to the tables it can frequently end up at more like 21-22%.

4bet range is way too tight in theory, but probably a good exploitative value for the limits played. I don't actually know what limits this is though. So long as it's 25nl and below it's fine. If it's higher, might be time to invest a little energy into 4bet strategy.

Generally speaking, float bet stats and probe bet stats are excellent. Well done.

Playing against floats is reasonable, you are probably slightly less exploitable than the population, but our opponents can still bet any 2 when we fold with 62.85% frequency. Ultimately we expect to fold around 50%, which still allows our opponent to bet any 2, but this is not a problem and is to be expected. The component of this strategy which is not well developed so far is the raise F float. This is 4.33% which suggests there may be one or two spots where we can check raise more aggressively as the PFR.

Same things apply for the turn. Now we are folding around 75% to turn floats, so we are barely defending our checking range. Keep in mind that this is not a big deal in most cases (depends on the limits), but is something to think about for future development.

Edit - Oh, I see you mentioned the limits in your next post. I guess I'm just reading one post at a time =D

@matty

VPIP/PFR look fine.

EP rfi looks overly aggressive. Even exploiting weak players in the blinds it's unlikely this value will reach higher than 15 or 16%. Even if it somehow reached 18%, it doesn't explain why the MP RFI is not propotionally higher also. Probably some small adjustments needed here.

3bet stuff looks good. Not sure what is going on in the BB though, really on the passive side. Most common spot to check for is BB vs a SB open. Check that 3bet frequency is at least 15% in this spot. Improving BB 3bet frequency is often just about increasing awareness regarding how wide we can go. We obviously cold-call a ton of hands in the BB which makes our 3bet bluffs extremely weak. If we don't realise how wide we can go in the BB then we'll end up with a 3bet frequency on the passive side.

Fold to 3bet seems too high tbh. Then again, maybe this isn't fold to 3bet after 2bet. In fact, it isn't. Make sure you don't have this stat on your HUD or anything, because it is useless.

Cold-call frequency is really tight. Should be more like 12-13%. Notice how our BTN cold-call frequency is barely any different from our MP cold-call frequency. It obviously should not be like this. MP cold-call can be around 6% whereas BTN cold-call should be more like 12%. BB cold-call frequency should also be a shade higher in most cases, 26% rather than 21.44. Make sure you are not folding too much to min-raises and stuff.

Fold to cbet stats look reasonable.

Cbet stats look passive as mentioned. There should actually be a big difference between cbet IP and OOP. Probably a good idea for you to check these. Cbet OOP can be very low, 40%. Remember that we should actually cbet some stuff, we probably don't want to check everything. So for our overall Cbet average to be high, this implies that Cbet IP is going to be over 70%. Maybe check these, and if you find Cbet IP is just around the 60% mark only, then maybe there is a problem.

Raise F cbet looks good.

WWSF looks kinda low. This is usually where we just check out the float and probe info. Float flop and Float turn need to be considerably higher. Closer to 70%. Probe Turn and Probe River are also super low. Basically we are missing a bunch of bluff spots postflop, so this is why our WTSD and WSD are through the roof, but our WWSF is low. Delayed turn cbet is also super super low. At the limits you are playing it should probably be more like 85%.

@w34z3l

Thanks for your time on this,

A great help and some spots to work on for sure…

I’ve actually started working on some of the same things you’ve pulled out so its great to know that I have been reviewing myself fairly well in some spots!

Yeh my fold to cbet river has been sticking out to me as a big leak over this course of hands and I’ve just started working on this and not calling down so light and it seems to have helped so yeh good to know that this needed work and I’m thinking in the right direction… I for sure over the last year or so had a problem being a nonbeliever when it came to river spots! I gotta start believin’!

WTSD yeh i figure this is high from my style of play… I think i need to value bet river a little more than i do…

Yeh even I’m surprised at my 4bet % — basically i took QQ and AK nearly completely out of my 4bet strategy as most of the time I’m most of the time Im just coming up against AA - KK
so i do throw through in some 4bet bluffs of course… when i feel its right

But maybe this is too nitty?

the whole playing against floats I’m gonna have to sit down and get me head around it all…

thanks again for your time, I’ll PM you for those River threads, thanks a bunch

John

Thank you so much for doing this, but first i have to point it out something on the OP at the end when u say..

"Skip flop/turn/river cbet and check/fold (In PT4 "fold vs flop/turn/river float")
Skip flop/turn/river cbet and check/raise (In PT4 " raise vs flop/turn/river float")
Skip flop/turn/river cbet and check/call (In PT4 "raise vs flop/turn/river float")"

I think u wanted to say "Call" vs flop/turn/river float

Here are my NL10 stat...

Attached Image

Hi,

Thank you so much for doing this, I have been wanting to do something like this for a while.

Most of these hands are from 50nl, a little 100nl and 25nl 6max (not much fast fold). Most of the games I play are 100bbs deep, but I do play maybe 1/3 50bb tables too which effects the hands I am willing to get in pre (wider).

I am concerned that my showdown/ non showdown lines are opposite to everyone else. It used to be much more extreme than this, with my red line at a positive 45 degree angle and my blue line at a negative 45 degree angle. But I have worked on reducing spewey aggression and calls. Though I do still like to make light call downs and bluff raises, I am hopefully more selective now. I am running 20 buyins below all in EV in this sample, which I think will have forced my blue line down, so maybe its not so bad?

In line with this I think my WTSD is high but my WSD and River call efficiency seem fine so I am not sure what to think about that.

Additionally I think I am loosing too much from the blinds and MP win rate (all in adjusted) seems a lot lower than CO so recently I have been trying to open up my MP range, particularly cold calling opens a bit wider (I think I flatted little here due to squeeze threats).
Anyway, gratefully to have the chance for someone to point out my leaks.

Attached Image

@Oblong Welcome to the forum!

Hi Weasel,

I can't believe this is for real. Thank you so much for your effort.
The stats below are a 50K sample of 10NL Rush poker. Although the winrates look decent I'm positive there are leaks as my red line is too steep for my liking, but again it just might be the showdown heavy nature of micro stake levels. Thanks again for any suggestions.

Regards,

Exte

Attached Image

I just noticed that my fold to c bet stats were obscured so here they are again. Attached Image

Hey guys just so you can get these quicker please note you must have 10 good forum posts to be able to receive the review. Welcome and good luck!

Jon-PokerVIP: Hey guys just so you can get these quicker please note you must have 10 good forum posts to be able to receive the review. Welcome and good luck!

Ahh ok, thanks for letting me know.

Does this count as a good forum post?

@Oblong Haha sure thing just make the rest dope

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